9:00 AM PST Sunday, March 29, 1987 (Sysop Tony) Good morning all. (Howard Parr) I'm new at this and don't know what's going on (Sysop Tony) Everybody wanna fix your handles and we'll get started? (James l.) I enter f2, a file name enter and get download aborts just trying to download the ./help file what is wrong? (Sysop Tony) After you press F2, what filename do you specify? and, Do you have any empty RAM when you try to download? (James l.) I was using M100h And how can i check file space on line...I do have ram enough... (Sysop Tony) M100H should be a good file name, so that's OK you can only check how much available RAM you have by being offline, or if you have run one of the utility programs that puts that function on one of your function keys. TELKEY.100 in DL3 will do it. (James l.) what if my main menu is full..will that cause problem??? (Sysop Tony) If your main menu is full, you have no space to download into. Let's see what Larry has to say. (Larry L) ok As far as RAM space noters...I can reccommend TELUTL and DIRACC wholeheartedly Telutl is short but Diracc allows use of TEXT and BASIC while online.. (Sysop Tony) Right! There are so many possible choices of what -can- be done, it's almost impossible to recommend any specific one. (James l.) thanks...my was simply no space on the directory of main.. (Sysop Tony) OK... then on to the next Q.... ga Tim (Tim B) Thanks I have two items to dicuss First is the Laptop User And the second is Wordstar <-> M100 file transfers But I really need to get Phil to another channel for that one First, I was really suprise to see what a fine mag. that J.D. had put out I was expecting much less. Especially when it is free! I would like to know what y'all think. (Sysop Tony) I haven't received one yet. Anyone want to comment? (James l.) how do you get it? (Sysop Tony) See the file MAG.100 in DL13. (Phil W) Well, I bought one at a newstand. It is very nicely done. On the plus side, good production quality, good range of coverage. On the other side, ('member, I paid for it!) it seemed pretty non-critical and , for my taste, not technical enough. BUT -- on the whole VERY positive! (Sysop Tony) Are you sure, Phil? The magazine is a controlled circulation publication, and is not supposed to be sold on stands. I think what you saw is Portable Computer Review, Put out by the Portable 100 people, from left over stuff from last year. (Phil W) Ah yes -- It was a Special edition -- I assumed because it was the first issue. Was editted by JD. But was a Special Issue. (Sysop Tony) Yes. A number of folks have been confused by that. Any more on that question, Tim? (Tim B) I have a specific problem and I have talked about it until most peoples ears have fallen off, but here goes... If I bore y'all just let me know. Let me try this with Phil and I get back OK. (Sysop Tony) OK... See you in a while. (Tim and Phil went off to channel 10 for a private chat) (Sysop Tony) Meanwhile, on to the next question. ga Howard (Howard P) Is there another DOS for the portable disk drive? (Sysop Tony) Yes, several. See the file DISKOS.INF in DL13, and follow up by reading the files it points to. (Howard P) How can I get ahold of one? (Sysop Tony) Read the file in DL13, and it will give you that information. (Howard P) Thanks alot. Thats all from me (Sysop Tony) OK.... Kim is next. ga Kim (Kim K) Ok, same area, any word on updates to DOS for TDD2? (Sysop Tony) None. No one has indicated any movement in that direction except Traveling Software who has modified certain programs for the new drive. However, some of the old DOS's will work with the new drive. See TD2TIP.001 in DL9. (Kim K) I have an old drive, a new one and the DVI, is there any hope of compatibility among them all? (Sysop Tony) Yes. Read the file TD2TIP.001 in DL9. (Kim K) next question, I need to get a database system for an IBM AT or 386 that I can access using the M100 as a terminal any ideas? (Sysop Tony) The only thing I can recommend is reading a file called REMOTE.IBM in DL13, which is said to allow you to use the M100 as a remote terminal keyboard for the IBM. I don't know if it works, or how to implement it. (Kim K) Ok thanks much, I'm done.. (Sysop Tony) One more thing. There is a remote program in one of the IBM forums, again, I don't know if it works, but Eiji has tried it and you might send him a message to ask. Eiji = 76703,4311. (Gerald G) When you mention using the m100 as a remote for IBM does that also include the compatibles, e.g. RC Sx 1000. (Sysop Tony) I don't know. I simply don't have enough information on the IBM type computers to recommend anything there. Maybe Phil would have some info He's still over in Channel 10, talking to Tim. (Gerald G) If the need should occur trs80 pro would be a good place I assume. (Mike H.) Am I right in assuming that any rom based dos software will conflict with existing m/l programs in ram?(for that matter disk base) (Sysop Tony) No, I don't think so. From what I've heard about the ROM based DOS of which SARDINE and Ultimate ROM-2 are the only examples I know of, they don't conflict with anything in the computer. (Mike H.) In particular Floppy on the tdd2? (Sysop Tony) Well, I believe my previous comment stands. But FLOPPY.CO is a big bag of worms, and there still isn't enough information out on the TD2 version to make any definitive reply. I'd recommend you get away from using FLOPPY.CO as soon as you can. (Kim K) There's a definate problem between DVI and other DOS, as well as new FLOPPY and old DOS (Sysop Tony) Yes, there is a definate problem with multiple DOS's in the same machine. They each want to use the system's hooks, and it can't be done. There are some programs in DL9 that allow you to disconnect (unload) one DOS, and activate another. Any more on that question, Mike? (Mike H.) I wonder if anyone has tried disk power and the new dos,I heard they were compat. but i want to be sure. (Sysop Tony) Read the file TD2TIP.001 in DL9 which deals with that question. (Howard P) If I write a program that accesses a file in another bank, will it work? (Sysop Tony) Only if you have that capability as provided by the manufacturer of the bank that you bought. PCSG has such capability, but I don't know about the others. (Howard P) I don't understand. (Sysop Tony) Well, if you buy a RAM expansion bank from PCSG they provide you with a ROM, or software, which will allow you to access files in the other banks. If you didn't buy PCSG's banks, then you'll have to contact the manufacturer, and see if his banks have that capability. (Howard P) So there is no way, with an as is machine to programmatically change ram banks? (Sysop Tony) No, not with an "as-is" machine. The original machine doesn't know that you are going to insert extra RAM banks, or that you've done so. (Howard P) Ok Thanks. (Sysop Tony) OK.... on to next question. ga Mike (Mike H.) On the sub. of m/l prog's. conflicting with each other, I have tried the prog. flipml in the dl's,it works but I still can't get the top,end and exec address for floopy on the new tdd2. I try loadm"flopp" and get ff error (no file) (Sysop Tony) Mike... I don't have a TD2, and don't know how FLOPPY loads there. but my guess is that because so many folks complained about FLOPPY in the TDD, that they changed it in the TD2 so that it didn't take up 7.5K of RAM space. You might try this: Once it's in RAM, and operational, go into BASIC and type: PRINT HIMEM;MAXRAM. Then remove FLOPPY, and type the same thing again. Write down the numbers. Consider the second set as #2. Reload FLOPPY, and then type: SAVEM"FLOPPY.CO",(himem1),(maxram2),(himem1) and see if it saves to the menu as FLOPPY.CO. If so, then go back to basic, and try LOADM"FLOPPY, and see if you get the addresses. (Mike H.) Thanks that sound like the best approach. (Sysop Tony) Question... how do you call FLOPPY to use it, if it's not on the menu? (Mike H.) it is on the menu. i wish i new that call address for basic though. (Sysop Tony) As a .BA or as a .CO program? (Mike H.) no extention tony. (Sysop Tony) Well, that shorts me out. They've totally changed it. Until someone comes along with a TD2TIP to cover it, afraid I'll be in the dark. (Mike H.) but strange thing in the disk directory there is the file flopy2.sys. (Sysop Tony) I'm afraid I can't help any further, Mike.... I'm just guessing. and what's on the disk is a whole unkown to me. Sorry. (Mike H.) Thanks i will try the method on getting the name change to .co. (Sysop Tony) OK... good luck. On to the next question. ga James (JAMES L. NUNN) I got the ./ help file after I cleared the garbage out of my menu but now when I printed it even though at width=120 i got only 40 (Sysop Tony) Probably, as the file is originally sent to you, it's sent as 40-wide. No matter what you do when printing, it's still 40-wide. You could change your terminal defaults. in the PROFILE section to 80. (JAMES L. NUNN) ok how about the fact that with only 192 bytes left in ram...the transmission of help stopped during the Version details "...it is very useful to include the...[? (Sysop Tony) How about that! (grin) I guess what you're asking, is "how come I still got 192 bytes left?" (JAMES L. NUNN) yes. (Sysop Tony) That's part of the reserved system buffer that is used to store variables, and stuff. You never... (JAMES L. NUNN) how much did i miss??? (Sysop Tony) lose that. It's always reserved and unavailable for your use. (JAMES L. NUNN) your text said five pages...how many kbytes is that? (Sysop Tony) James, who are you talking to? (JAMES L. NUNN) [ga?] tony (Sysop Tony) James.... I assume you dropped offline for a minute... (JAMES L. NUNN) not me ga tony (Sysop Tony) when you came back, you didn't reset your name. we're getting your full name now. (JAMES L. NUNN) what is ...standby (james l.) better what about the length of the help file???kbytes? (Sysop Tony) I don't know. Don't have access to system information. That's part of CompuServe's software, not a file I have access to, other than by downloading it. (james l.) your text says it is five pages long how much is that?? (Sysop Tony) "My Text"???? Where do I say that? (james l.) in the intro to h (Sysop Tony) I'm sorry, James. Apparently we're not communicating here. I haven't written any help file that's 5 pages long that I can remember. I don't have access to the system's files, so don't know anything about them. However, why do you want to "download" such stuff? Why not just echo it to your printer? (james l.) good idea tony...thx (Sysop Tony) OK... if no more on that then on to the next in the lineup. ga Howard (Howard P) What's the difference between the TDD and the TD2? Just the DOS or did they redesign the hardware too? (Sysop Tony) Howard, can you type shorter lines so we know you're still there? (Howard P) sure (Sysop Tony) The TDD holds 100K, and the TD2 holds 200K on a disk. And apparently it's DOS loads differently. (Howard P) That all? (Jeff Streutker) [don't forget difference in price] (Sysop Tony) That's all -I- know about! But then, I don't have one. Let's see what others have to say. (Howard P) ok (Sysop Tony) But Jeff, they were both originally $199. The TDD only came down to clear them out before the TD2 came out. (james l.) td2 is 199 in buffalo...when will the price come down??? (Sysop Tony) When the TD3 is released. (grin). (larry r) I have a TDD2 and am quite pleased with its performance as a storage device/ram saver. I understand there is supposed to be a way to mushfake one's way around the problem of downloading to disk from the modem which I am currently exploring ( a local BBS claims to have something for it but I haven't picked it up yet much less played with it) Yet that's not that big a problem 'cos with reliable external storage, I can just clean out most of my RAM B4 goin' on line if I want to pick up a RAMload of goodies for sorting out and playing with off line. I've had no serious problems (REDIAL.JD2 fixed my disk drive/modem conflict bug) and am quite happy with it! Others will, of course have other opinions as a rank amateur, I rank it pretty darn good!!! (Sysop Tony) There are only two known ways to download to a TDD or TD2 while online. One is by "simulating" it; using an external modem, either to hold the line while you go off to use the disk, or by using the external modem for communications, with a switch to select the computer output, or by building a second RS-232 port that connects to the system buss, as described in the September 86 issue of 80-micro magazine. If your local BBS has another way, I'd like to know about it. (larry r) This SYSOP told me he had something what allows 4 the use of the internal built in modem. ga Tony take it away! (Sysop Tony) I have something that allows use of the internal modem too it's called TELCOM. .... Anyway if he has something useful, let us know. I doubt he's come up with anything shattering, though. Too many smart folks have already tried it. For a year and a half so far and although claims have been made, no one has yet done it. (larry r) I'll let ya know. (Sysop Tony) OK... would appreciate any new info so I'm not continualy sticking my foot in my mouth. (Jeff Streutker) Tony, the help listing James was talking about was what came when you typed H at the main promt... It recommends that you download it, and that it is 5 pages long Nothing about the size of these pages, but I guess it would be the size of a default page. (Sysop Tony) Yes, and I repeat, that's a System File, and I have nothing to do with it. But what, may I ask, is the size of a default page? I'd guess that they expect it to be 300 lines long on a printer. (Jeff Streutker) No, I think it is 24 lines by either 40 or 80 characters. (Sysop Tony) Then that would be about 120 lines. It's all academic anyway as James problem seemed to be that he was trying to download it into RAM, with insufficient RAM. his question was, "How much RAM do I need to download 5 pages?" So, what is the definition of a "page"? That depends on what sort of "page" you're talking about. A "page" of paper? 60 lines, ... (larry r) 54! (Sysop Tony) 80 columns? A CRT screen "page" 24 x 80? ... (larry r) 10 or 12 pitch? (Sysop Tony) or an LCD screen page, 8 x 40? It's a question that can't be answered without defining the question further. (Jeff Streutker) Right! that's what I wanted to point out. CIS is at fault here. (Sysop Tony) Or "DEfault"! (grin) Well, there's always the complaint desk, GO FEEDBACK. (grin) But I don't think they'll listen. OK... (larry r) Y START NOW? (Sysop Tony) let's see... Chris is waiting. Any more on this before we talk to Chris? (Jeff Streutker) no. gone for the moment (Sysop Tony) OK..... then you're up, Chris. ga Chris (Chris) Ok, First, How cheaply and where can I get 3 8k chips for my 8k M100 (yes, 8k) and is there any diff between different RAM chips? (Sysop Tony) Well, they average about $20-$25 apiece, and there are several companies that sell them. Expanding RAM is a common interest of many users, so we have prepared a file on the subject that covers much more than we can here. See the file, EXPAND.RAM in DL13. If you have a 102 See EXPAND.102. If you want a LOT of RAM space, see BIGRAM.INF. (Chris) Ok, is there anyway to dump to a cassette while online? (Sysop Tony) Yes, but not from TELCOM directly. You have to be running a terminal emulator program, such as one of the XMODEM programs, that can address the cassette for output. ... (Jeff Streutker) [TERM.BA?] (Sysop Tony) XMODEM.312 will do it for you. TERM.BA, recommended by Jeff, is one that you can buy from Radio Shack, but why buy when you can get better ones here by downloading them. (Jeff Streutker) [true] (Chris) Thanks, that's about all I've got for now. I've been using this as a dumb terminal and printing everything I want to keep It's a real (noisy) pain. Thanks. (Sysop Tony) OK... I guess we covered that. Any more Chris before we go on? (Chris) none at all! (thank you) (Sysop Tony) OK... then ga Jeff (Jeff Streutker) Are there any experts on POWR-DISK on board? (Sysop Tony) Well, I have used it. ... Got a question? (Jeff Streutker) yes, I want to know how to back up a disk (PDD) sector by sector, without using FLOPPY.CO. Any ideas? (Sysop Tony) As I recall, there's a backup utility in DL9 for the TDD disk system. It is, or was, part of the DSKMGR alternate DOS for the TDD. Exactly how it works I can't recall though, and don't recall if there is a backup utility that comes with Power-Disk. I've only backed up one TDD disk, and although I have about 30, have never yet lost a disk, so don't bother any more. (Jeff Streutker) Neither have I, but it's a matter of backing up the master disk which I have been unsuccessful in trying. (Sysop Tony) Well, I've only used the Power-Disk Utility Disk one time. To originally load the DOS from disk. Never again, since. I've never lost it. (larry r) DON'T 4GET MURPHY!!!! (Jeff Streutker) I sometimes had to do cold starts, and that's why I need it. anyways, go on to next in lineup. (Sysop Tony) Do you have any extra RAM banks? (Jeff Streutker) I only have the RS chips up to 32 K. (Sysop Tony) OK If you get at least one extra RAM bank, you can "store" stuff there and when you cold start the main bank, reload from the storage bank. That way you don't have to start over from scratch. (Jeff Streutker) This info in BIGRAM.INF? (Sysop Tony) BIGRAM is a lot of $$$ and a lot of RAM for storage. 7 extra banks. 1 extra bank would do it. And a single bank can be had on the used market for about $50. (BILL HEIMAN) comment ! (Jeff Streutker) you'll have to tell me about where info on extra banks are. never heard of the subject. (Sysop Tony) Well, start off by reading EXPAND.RAM in DL13, and go from there. Let's hear from Bill. ga Bill (BILL HEIMAN) I just installed Nodes 256k rambank two days ago..and it seems to work fantastic. (Sysop Tony) Well, the NODE RAMBANK is a different animal. And, over $500.... (BILL HEIMAN) negitive (Sysop Tony) But any extra RAM bank can be used to store... (BILL HEIMAN) about $1.00 per k of ram they have a 36 k for abt 50 dollars (Sysop Tony) Bill... if you're going to continue a conversation, then don't end your sentences with "ga" as I take that to mean you're through. Let's sort this out. ... (BILL HEIMAN) sorry my mix up (Sysop Tony) PCSG has a 256K RAM bank of 7 extra banks for over $500. NODE has a 256 bank of continuous RAM which is used primarily for storage. But this is all above Jeff's needs. He wants to know how to reload Power-Disk. ... So let's get back to the original concept here. He can store Power-Disk in ANY, repeat, ANY, of the RAM banks. Which he choose is entirely up to him. Again, I recommend reading EXPAND.RAM in DL13, and go from there. (larry r) OK If you can only use 32 K at a time what is the advantage of blowing 500 bucks on 7 banks if all you can access at 1 time is only 32 K? Or am I misunderstanding something?? (Sysop Tony) Good question. .... Why spend $500 on extra RAM, when the computer may have only cost $300? Some folks use the extra banks for different purposes. Such as 1 for business, 1 for games, 1 for telecommunications 1 for memos and schedules, 1 for ... and so on. Personally, I'd opt for a Chipmunk disk drive, as 1 disk is the equivalent of a dozen extra RAM banks. 3 disks = over a megabyte of storage, and programs can directly access the disk files. So much better it's pitiful to consider any other options. (For the money!). The TDD buyers who get a drive, then spend more money to make it more than a simple storage medium are missing the boat, in my opinion. ... (BILL HEIMAN) Tony do you understand how the node bank works ? (Sysop Tony) By the time you buy a TDD, and software, and an extra modem, to be able to download to disk, you could have bought a Chipmunk. Trouble is, when it's full, it's full! With a Chipmunk, When one disk is full, you put in another. (larry r) ok. is there a file in any DL which does a comparison of these various options, especially disk drive features? if so its name and location? (Sysop Tony) Yes, several. All in DL9 or DL13. But I've been preaching the better value of the Chipmunk for two years, and very few folks listen. They get a TDD because it's "on sale", without regard to what it's capabilities are. But that's all my editorializing for today. We have a couple more questions to deal with today, and very little time. In fact, almost none. (DAVID E) [i got mine because I could CHARGE IT] (Sysop Tony) See! an exact example... (Sysop Tony) (We're running over today, folks. ) Go ahead, Dana, (Dana H.) How does the Chip's operating system compare to that of the DVI? (device address...) and amount of memory used. (Sysop Tony) Basically the same, but Chipmunk is superior. Random access is only one example. I don't recall how much RAM the DVI DOS uses, about 4K I'd guess... (Dana H.) 4697 (Sysop Tony) CDOS uses 5K, but is reloadable by pressing the reset button. So you can kill it, and reload it at any time, very conveninetly. (Dana H.) Interesting. Those 360 K disks are appealing. (Sysop Tony) I'm very satisfied with mine. Using it right now to download the CO transcript. The TDD will never match the Chipmunk capability but the Chipmunk is best used with a M100, It CAN work with a 200, and 102, but with limited capability due to machine differences. (200 can't download to disk and 102 needs machine modification) Let's hurry along... (DAVID E) Mine is more of a comment from last week The reason I don't use the index files is because you don't know what the program does. only the name. (Sysop Tony) Yes, that's a shortcoming of the INDEX. But that's what an INDEX is for; to tell you where to look for the information. The CAT files are more informative, but also much more space consuming, and cost more $$$ to download. (DAVID E) With keyword though you would at least have an idea what they do. (Sysop Tony) Do you have a copy of "The Best of" for this forum? (DAVID E) yes that is what i found the best to handle it as but you said it was a 1 a year thing. (Sysop Tony) OK... what they did there, was make the index, based on keywords. listing the files that the keywords referenced. Every file that used the keyword "Disk" was listed under "Disk". The purpose of OUR index is to tell you where the file is located, who wrote it, and how big it is. A "Keyword Index" is something we haven't even considered, because it would have to cross reference not only the file names, but also where they are located. The present index is over 80K. A keyword index would EASILY be over 400K. NO ONE has the time and $$$ to download that, and keep it updated. We are just now developing a way to update the current INDEX files. (DAVID E) Agreed with the time and $ but with the prog you are creating the cross ref is done by the prog and if only one major keyword was used then at least you can guess whether it is usful to you. (Sysop Tony) Which keyword would you select as relevant? Of the 8 or 10 left by the authors, which often aren't relevant at all. Example: "THIS PROGRAM RUNS ON A M100". What's the "keyword" here? Let me point out, that CompuServe provides no index capabilty at all, and what we're providing now, takes time and effort to produce. If you'd like to develop a different type of index system, and the programs to develop it, we'd be only too happy to use it. But don't expect US to do more than we're doing now. Eiji spends almost full time updating the indexes and catlaog files for you folks now. There's no extra time to develop something new. (DAVID E) I agree and am very thankful for the time and effort put in to this sig. I has been a very big help to me and I don't wish to jepordize its time for helping others. THANKS (Sysop Tony) OK. Well, we have run well over our allotted time this week... So I'll end the formal conference now. Feel free to stick around and chat further, if you like. Thanks for coming this morning, we appreciate your input. Bye. *** END OF CONFERENCE *** List of Participants: 70250,211 PETER 70516,1444 JOE SCHMITT 71260,734 Kim K 71266,125 Phil W 72276,3505 john k 72300,2300 Howard P 72300,3072 BILL HEIMAN 72300,3604 JAMES L. NUNN 72466,2054 LEE WARREN 72516,475 larry r 72517,712 Tim B 72527,765 Dana H. 73127,2630 Dave Sommer 73127,3034 DAVID E. TRIMBLE 73127,3341 CHRIS PACE 73127,36 DAVID E 73170,350 DAVID BROOKING 73210,3443 Chris 73347,2512 Mike H. 73537,1276 Daniel A. Fort 73765,605 Larry L 74425,231 Gerald G 75755,1312 Jeff S 76120,2244 CHARLES CULHANE 76703,376 \/\/ayne 76703,444 Sysop Denny 76703,4062 Sysop Tony