7:00:00 PM PST, Sunday January 24, 1988 (R Caley) Hi All (Sysop Tony) Hi Rush. (R Caley) Are we the only ones here? (Sysop Tony) Yep. (R Caley) What's with the new time? (Sysop Tony) What do you mean by "What's with"? Seems self-evident to me we're holding it now, because sysops are not available on Sunday mornings, on a regular basis. A Sysop needs to be here for a formal CO. ga (gene) [I'm here] (R Caley) Ohhhhh....sorry. (Sysop Tony) Nothing to be sorry about. It's just the way things work out lately. ga (R Caley) Well I have no burning issues I'm having a good time with CARDFIL.ga (Sysop Tony) Glad to hear it.... ga Gene (gene) I'll wait until your finished (Sysop Tony) Nothing really to finish, I think... so ga. (gene) What other goodies are you 'holding' from us? e.g. Secret.BA (Sysop Tony) Holding? Didn't realize I was holding back anything I often speak my mind with too much clarity and get myself in trouble. But that's another story. (gene) Query.BA must be 2-3 yrs old, & I never did figure out the prg until now. (Sysop Tony) Boy, that's an oldie - unusual, and serves little purpose. But it was my Christmas gift one year. ga (gene) Well I like Secret & what it does (Sysop Tony) Yeah... now I thought that was a neat trick. (gene) Good Documentation! (Sysop Tony) No one has ever commented on it's use like that, though. I guess there are some cases where you'd want to hide the text stuff. ga (gene) Good for "Copywrite" etc. So it can't be deleted from orig. ogr. (Sysop Tony) That's a good idea. ..... (Sysop Tony) I know it's done that way in some ML programs. Sort of sneaky. (gene) real sneaky!!! Is there an AUTO prg on this SIG...auto numbering for typing Basic prgs? ga (Sysop Tony) I don't think so. ... don't recall seeing one but there was one printed in one of the magazines recently. (gene) I got one form PCM & if it's alright I'll upload it...pretty good prg with lots of options ga (Sysop Tony) Maybe that's where I saw it. But if it's theirs, you can't upload it without permission. Better check, or rewrite it yourself. It would be better in BASIC, anyway. (gene) Well, I bought the mag & it isn't protected (Sysop Tony) The mag, and everything in it is copyrighted. Buying it doesn't convey the rights to replublish elsewhere. ga (gene) That's right, I remember reading that (Sysop Tony) Well, let's see if we have some other questions. (gene) How about if I use "whisper"? (BOB CRAFT) Just to clarify, you said you didn't get DO3 right? (Sysop Tony) No, DO3 didn't arrive. Only PR4. I was waiting for DO3 so we could merge them together. ga (KEITH SMITH) Good evening all (BOB CRAFT) OK I'll slip out now and send it up. Bye (Sysop Tony) OK, thanks. ga Arnold, (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) Has anyone used the cryptonics rambank for the 102? (Sysop Tony) Probably so... but probably no one here It's usually hard to find someone in conference that has used a specific product... just too many products, not enough conferences. ga (KEITH SMITH) I need techy advice on receiving weather fax on a 100....anyone? (Dave Grabowski) hmm. (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) I couldn't find anything in the dl's (Sysop Tony) (Keith, we take turns here, Arnold has the floor, you'll be next after him.) (KEITH SMITH) understand (Sysop Tony) Well, Arnold, you can always leave a message on the board (Dave Grabowski) <-confused (Sysop Tony) and see if someone can give you some additonal information. ga (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) will do ga keith (Sysop Tony) OK.... ga Keith, (KEITH SMITH) my turn? (Sysop Tony) Yes, Keith, go ahead. (Dave Grabowski) <-still confused. (gene) [c for Keith query] (Sysop Tony) (Dave, we take turn speaking. Keith has the floor now, you'll be next after him) (KEITH SMITH) qyes gene (Sysop Tony) Go ahead Keith, you have the floor. (gene) What do you want? (Sysop Tony) Ignore everybody else, and go ahead. (Dave Grabowski) oh. (KEITH SMITH) Does OK....I need advice on using the 100 to receive weather info...both on compusrve AND via radio (Dave Grabowski) "ga"? (gene) Keith, I use G AWX 4 for weather maps... (KEITH SMITH) what software? (gene) & RLEPRT for hardcopy. Just go (on Compu) GO WEATHER command (Sysop Tony) Keith ... (gene) no software (KEITH SMITH) yes (Sysop Tony) There are several programs in DL3 which will draw pictures... (KEITH SMITH) ga (Sysop Tony) of the data downloaded from the picture services. Go to Data Library #3, (DL3), and use the command S/KEY RLE to get a list. BRO/KEY RLE will give you descriptions. ga Any more on this, Keith? Keith? Any more on this subject? ga (KEITH SMITH) yes....do you think it possible to download data transmitted via radio...any suggestions (Sysop Tony) I haven't heard of anyone doing it... (Dave Grabowski) it can be done on other computers. (Sysop Tony) but perhaps you can get some help on that in the Ham Radio Forum. GO HAMNET to get there. (Dave Grabowski) I7m sure yo can find out a way to do it on a m100. (KEITH SMITH) igood idea....thank you for your time (Sysop Tony) OK Gene, did you have any more comments? (gene) no done (Sysop Tony) OK. (EARL BUSACKER) My Turn? (Sysop Tony) Then you're up, Dave. ga Dave. No Earl, it's Dave's Turn. I'll let you know when it's your turn. (Dave Grabowski) ahh.. goodie.. just q quickie here.. do you guys know of anywhere that I can get the 8k ram exp for my m100? dealing through my local radio shack is such a pain.. and do yo know a price? ga (Sysop Tony) Gee Dave, there must be a dozen places. And the average price is about 22 bucks. ... (Dave Grabowski) oh. (Sysop Tony) Read the file EXPAND.RAM in DL13. (Dave Grabowski) ok.. thanx a bunch. ga, (Sysop Tony) OK, any more on this topic, guys? (gene) NODE sells them for $19 in lots of 3 (Sysop Tony) But you only need 3 if you have an 8K machine, which was ... (Dave Grabowski) I only need one. (Sysop Tony) Discontinued, long ago. (gene) ok done (Sysop Tony) OK. You're up now, Earl. ga Earl (Bill Heiman) [Hi guys] (Sysop Tony) Hmmm Earl didn't stick around for his turn. (gene) [hi Bill" (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) Qq will there be a new edition of BEST OF THE MODEL 100 FORUM soon? (Sysop Tony) Don't know, Arnold... We have no control on that It's put out by CompuServe. Whenever they feel like it, I guess. They should have done an update some time ago. ga (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) I liked the last issue, but there's so much new that I can't keep track...ga (EARL BUSACKER) M200 problem: When I try to use Mplan I get a beep then a message flashes which says MP work area in use. (Sysop Tony) I'll give you some ideas on that in a minute, Arnold. Earl, MSPLAN uses the area directly below MAXRAM to store it's files in a pseudo-.CO form. If you have used that area for a machine language program, and HIMEM does not equal MAXRAM, then the program says, "The area is already in use." ga (EARL BUSACKER) c Thank you, Now I get it. I have DSKMGR INRESIDENCE . Thank you again. (Sysop Tony) That's it. You'll have to clear it out before you can use MSPLAN again. (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) could earl use the relocatable version of dskmgr to avoid these problems? (Sysop Tony) Well, yes and no. It would have to be relocated to the area known as LOMEM, so that the HIMEM barrier was not moved from MAXRAM. James Yi developed that technique for the 200's. There is a file on it in DL10. But the improtant point is that HIMEM must = MAXRAM in order to use MSPLAN. ga (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) (Sysop Tony) OK ga Bob (BOB CRAFT) I'm having trouble with 3 machine language programs coresiding They worked fine while I had copies of all three in HI and LO mem but now that I'm trying to use BASIC drivers ULTRASCREEN gets blown away DSKMGR and TXTFMT are the other two loaded in that order. Any suggestions ga (Sysop Tony) I don't doubt it. It's tough to get more than one ML program to reside (and execute) properly. The machine was really designed for only one. We've managed to "trick" them by layering programs, so they "appear" as one but if a program grabs system hooks, and another program also wants those hooks, there's no known way to make them coreside peacefully. ga Paul ga (Paul G) Well the topic seems to have changed but In the T200, for MSPLAN to work HIMEM does NOT have to equal MAXRAM the conditions are 1) himem must be less than 59638..and the locations 61102 and 61103 must be the ascii value for "MP"...ga (Sysop Tony) OK, Paul. ga Arnold (ARNOLD SILVERMAN) I think that flipml.100 in dl 7 might help bob craft (gene) [agree] (Sysop Tony) It might. The basic problem is that he wants to have all three of those programs available and "working" at the same time. That may not be possible. ga Bob ga (BOB CRAFT) I CAN have them working together if I'm willing to let them gobble that much memory (and FLIP.ML is a good education ) (Sysop Tony) Well, once they are loaded into their executing positions, You CAN kill the .CO versions on the menu. They don't have to stay there if you got the programs successfully loaded. (BOB CRAFT) But that's the problem. When I delete the CO files and use a driver, that's...when I lose ULTRASCREEN - tahnks anyway ga (Sysop Tony) Well, why don't you delete the .CO files, and save the whole thing as one complete program, then when it's loaded delete the .CO copy? .... Also you're going to have to figure out how to use a CALL to execute the programs you want; or somehow enter them without a "driver". (Whatever THAT is) ga (gene) ["driver = RUNM"] (BOB CRAFT) A driver is a basic program with this sort of text: RUNM"TXTFMT",Top,end,exec (Sysop Tony) That's the problem, right there. As I said, you have to CALL them once loaded, to run without problem. (Sysop Denny) That's it. Doing a RUNM without the program on the menu will cause an error Might even kill off programs that are loaded below or above the program you are runm'ing. ga (Sysop Tony) More, Bob? (BOB CRAFT) Well, the TXTFMT & DSKMGR load fine thay way but I guess I have more to learn. Thanks ga That's all (gene) Bob, what they are trying to convey is: CALL xxxxx (EARL BUSACKER) One difference w/my M00 it uses a drfiver for DSKMGR which is a one line progtam: 1 CLEARO, 60700: RUNM"DSKMGR" ga (Sysop Tony) Why is that a problem, Earl? Are you also trying to overlay TXTFMT and ULTRASCREEN? ga OK, let's take a quick course on machine language programs, here... (gene) [CLEARO a typo I hope - CLEAR0] (Sysop Tony) Let's say you have three programs which do not conflict with each other. .... (EARL BUSACKER) No problem with M100. My question: The M200 does not have a driver for the DSKMGE does that make a difference? ga (Sysop Tony) Let's also say one loads at 60000, one loads at 59000 and one loads at 58000. You can LOADM them in BASIC, and from then on, run each one with a CALL to the entry address for that program. It's usually the same as the starting address; but not always. OK? ga Paul (Paul G) Is there any interest in seeing Sardine ... (Sysop Tony) Earl, since Phil Wheeler developed that program, he'd be the best one to ask about it. (Paul G) available on-line to be used with TELCOM? (ROGER A. KELLY) good evening ! (Sysop Tony) Exactly how did you think about implementing it? Automatically check each word as typed or what? (Paul G) GRPH W for the current word being typed.. (Sysop Tony) Well, I think that first you'd have to clear it with Traveling Software since they hold some pretty tight copyrights over the stuff. Then, if it was any good, they'd probably want to add it to their line. So it's being made available is probably academic. ga Denny ga (Sysop Denny) The way Sardine works now, it will allow you to check a word that you have just typed, or any word that you put the cursor behind. (BOB CRAFT) 'bye all (Sysop Denny) That would be great if you could do that online. I am always searching for my dictionary. I think TS would have to implement the enhancement. It's just a matter of finding enough interest to make them do it. ga (Eric) Hi (Paul G) I've already sent TSI the details and fully explained the concept (ROGER A. KELLY) Question: where cani find a system map for the the 200? (Paul G) I couldn't give them the exact code.. (Sysop Tony) Any more on that topic? Guess not. ga Roger (Paul G) That's up to the users here. Anyone want to campaign TSI? (Sysop Tony) Roger has the floor now. ga Roger (ROGER A. KELLY) what i am looking for in particular is where the do fills are stored ? (Sysop Tony) Files are stored dynamically that is, they move around according to the system's needs. ... (ROGER A. KELLY) please expand (Sysop Tony) So there is no "one place". Suggest you get a copy of RAMDIR.200 from DL10, and run it to do a little exploring. ga Any more on this, Roger? ga (ROGER A. KELLY) thank you Tony! i am trying to modify a epence program to work on the 200 (Sysop Tony) epence? (ROGER A. KELLY) expense (Sysop Tony) Oh! There is one in DL4 that might work without modification. Have you tried that? At any rate, what difference would it make ... (ROGER A. KELLY) that is the one that i am trying to modify (Sysop Tony) where (exactly) the file was stored? You don't access it at the address level. ga Well, generally, all you have to change are statements that include PEEK, POKE or CALL. All the rest should run without problem. (ROGER A. KELLY) in the program it has two addsess's to look for particulare Do files (Sysop Tony) When you're finished, type the letters "ga" so we'll know. (ga = go ahead) (ROGER A. KELLY) ok tony (Sysop Tony) I'm not familiar with the program but it may be looking at the file directory. Suggest you leave a message on the board about it, and see what help develops. ga (ROGER A. KELLY) tony then i sould change the Peek ? (Sysop Tony) Well, generally, yes. peeks are specific to the machine where the program is running so if it was orignally written for the 100, and has a PEEK in it, then you'd have to change that for the 200. (ROGER A. KELLY) in what repect? (Sysop Tony) You have to change the address. (ROGER A. KELLY) to conform to it's new address in the 200(the program)? (gene) [EQU100.200 ?] (Sysop Tony) No, to conform to the differences between the operating systems between the 100 and 200. Almost all the ROM addresses are different, as are the storage locations in "Reserved RAM" area. What you peek in the 100 is not likely to be in the same place in the 200. ga (ROGER A. KELLY) ant locations the i can make the changes? (Sysop Tony) If you know the address differences, you make a change in the program, yes. ga (ROGER A. KELLY) thank you very much Tony!!!!!!!!!!! I concede the floor. (Sysop Tony) OK.... then Rune is next. ga Rune (rune cook) help. im totally new. quex is this: (Sysop Tony) What kind of help do you need? (rune cook) wassa best buy? 102, 200, or 600? (Sysop Tony) A Zenotronic 1710. (rune cook) howmuch? (gene) [boo] (Sysop Tony) $3750.05 Forgive me, Rune ... (rune cook) yer a big help. (Sysop Tony) but that's a bit like asking what's good in a Restaurant. Folks have been debating for years, which is the "BEST" computer ... (rune cook) well,the 102, 200 are $5c; the 600 is 6c. (Sysop Tony) Your offhanded question has no answer. There are too many variables ... (rune cook) so among them (Sysop Tony) involved in making a sensible decision to even approach an answer, since no one knows how you are going to use the computer, what you want it to do ... (rune cook) just write and keep a few addresses. (Sysop Tony) how experienced you are, what you can do yourself, what you will have to rely on others to do.... etc. (rune cook) hmmm. (Sysop Tony) It helps if you wait until I'm done before you type away. Anyway, there are several thread files in the data libraries ... (rune cook) i see; (Sysop Tony) which discuss this sort of thing. In general, CHOICE.THD and CHOIC2.THD in DL13 will start you off If you are interested in the 600, then see M600, M600AA, M600AB, M600AC etc, in DL11. (rune cook) i see...that's helpful. tx. (Sysop Tony) OK. .... ga Gene (gene) Rune, welcome...where are you? (rune cook) kc, mo. (gene) ok done (Sysop Tony) OK.... ga Ron (Ron) My SuperROM data files are acting kind of funny. With the passage of time when I access them they hang my 100 up (no key commands) When I reload the same files from my disk drive-no problem! Can CA. (CO.) go "stale" from lack of use?ga (Sysop Tony) Solving that sort of problem by long distance, without access to the files, your computer, or the program to see what's happening, is not much better than a guess. But there's no reason your files should change, not any reason your program should change. (Paul G) bad memory! (Sysop Tony) Perhaps it's simply the phase of the moon. (Ron) Memory checks OK (Paul G) who oops (Ron) Everything works just fine except when I store a CA. file for a long time in RAM without accessing it Cold start! (29638) (ROGER A. KELLY) all i have to say is that was nice meeting you all and that i will be back next week!!!!!!!!!!! (Ron) Can I finish? (Sysop Tony) Any more comments on Ron' problem? Yes, ga Ron. (gene) nite Roger (Ron) Anyway Can machine language files (CA.,CO.) go "stale" with time? Yes/No.ga (Sysop Tony) No reason for them to. Yes/No is an inappropriate response. No, they are not supposed to. Yes, apparently it's happening to you. ga (Ron) Does this spell doom for my 100? (Sysop Tony) Not likely. That's a big jump from, "I've got a problem", to "Thrown the damn thing out". It's just one of those things you have to deal with. We all have to deal with that sort of thing now and then. These portables are not perfect. They do have limitations and inherent problems. ga (Ron) OK I accept that. Nite all! (rune cook) is screen edit possible w/ 200 on cis? (Sysop Tony) Define "Screen edit" (rune cook) can i write a comment and edit it in separate screen area while conv. underway? (Sysop Tony) Yes and no. No provision for that provided by CompuServe Other than viewing or cancelling a complete line ... (gene) [split/screen?] (Sysop Tony) or backspacing over incorrect characters. There are, however split-screen programs for the 200, which will let you see what' you're typing apart from what is happening on your screen. You can still only edit on the line you're typing, but it doesn't get sent until you hit ENTER. Not like now, where each character gets sent as it's typed. .... But No, it's not a separate area where you can type or edit text before sending, if it's more than one line. ga (rune cook) well, tx. i'll be back next week. (Sysop Tony) Uh huh. Time for one last question... mayhbe two quickies. ga Gene (gene) Why won't a Search & Replace prg recogonize a GRAPH e as a Return? GRAPH e = symbol for Return/Enter (Sysop Tony) Because that's not how it's actually stored in the file. In your file, in RAM, it's actually two characters, 13 (CR) and 10 (LF). The ROM displays this on the screen as ONE character, CHR$(143). It's a convenience only. ga (gene) ok done thanks (Sysop Tony) OK... Anything else, anyone? (gene) Say Goodnite Tony! (Sysop Tony) OK... then Well, it looks like we're out of time for this morning's conference. So I'll end the formal conference now. Feel free to stick around and chat further, if you like. Thanks for coming this morning, we appreciate your input. Bye. *** END OF FORMAL CONFERENCE *** Humph! Gotta change those macros. (gene) good turn out see ya (Sysop Tony) Good night all. List of Participants: 70721,2540 KEITH SMITH 72076,2735 BOB CRAFT 72157,1264 Rich W 72256,2551 Gary D. 72300,3645 Ron 72306,1776 mark northup 73107,170 BRAD NOFFSINGER 73317,2757 rune cook 73720,3550 mark lawson 76317,350 DaveR 76537,255 MCKIBBIN 76672,2222 ARNOLD SILVERMAN 76672,577 Eric 76701,40 Sysop Denny 76703,4062 Sysop Tony