Fm: JIM DAVIS 74035,40 To: All What are the main differences between these 3 basic laptops? My reading indicates they are mostly the same, with some minor (?) differnces. I know that the M100 has an internal 300 bps modem & that the 8201 does not, that the 8201 has cursor keys and the M100 doesn't, and that some people say the 8201's screen is slightly more readable than the M100's. How about other major differences, particularly as related to add-on purchases of hardware and software? And since there is an M-10 for sale cheap on the SIG, I am most interested right this minute in the M-10 comparison, which I have not read anyway. Thanks for your help. jsd Fm: Sysop Dave Thomas 76703,446 Jim: Let me assure you that the differences are NOT minor. None of the three (all made by Kyocera) have the same addresses, thus programs are not compatible if they depend on CALL, PEEK, POKE, VARPTR statements. Clearly, no machine code files are compatible amongst them. In the DL 7 database, see M100NE.PMS and M10ROM.DIF files. Note that this SIG is the only support on CompuServe for both the NEC and the M-10 Olivetti. Compare DL 7 contents with those found in the other databases. Of course, a large part of the Basic programs for the Model 100 will run on the Olivetti, but all hardware support that I'm aware of will NOT operate witht the Olivetti. [Oops! Correction: cassette recorders work ok.] Good luck ... .^Dave^. Fm: Mark Schneider 75026,154 Jim: I'm an 8201A user and very happy with it. So let me begin by saying that my information on the Model 100 may be faulty as I've never spent much time using one. And my information on the 8201A may be colored by the fact that it fits my current needs so well. I think your decision about buying one of this family of laptops should be based on what exactly you want to use it for. They all use a 80C85 8-bit processor and so face the inherent 64k limitation. 32k is reserved for ROM and 32 for RAM. The RAM limitation can be "tricked" by bank switching. This was built into the NEC and appeared after-market on the Model 100. The NEC was designed to have 3 banks of 32k. Two internal and one through the expansion bus. One company, Purple Computing of California, makes an add-on for the NEC called the Sidecar which fits into the expansion bus on the side of the machine and has up to four additional banks of 32k RAM built in. You select which of these banks you want so that when you switch to bank 3 you get either A, B, C, or D, depending on which you selected. So the NEC is now easily capable of having 6 banks of 32k RAM. I believe the memory expansion devices for the Model 100 are a little more awkward since they appeared as an afterthought. These machines are all made by the same company (Kyocera of Japan) but there are certain differences. You are correct that there is no built-in internal modem on the 8201A. This I think was a design error by NEC since the value of these machines to journalists and salespersons is obvious. A Los Angeles Company (Touchbase) makes a 300 baud internal modem for the NEC which was selling for $99 last time I looked. You are mistaken that the Model 100 does not have cursor keys. It is just that they are arranged in a row instead of in the much more convenient diamond pattern on the NEC. The NEC also has 10 function keys as compared to 8 on the 100. The NEC is wedged shaped so that the screen sits at a better angle for viewing, while the 100 is flat so that it travels in less space. Personally, I prefer the easier viewing screen. (Screen readability has long been the fatal flaw of laptops). The NEC version of Microsoft BASIC is, I believe, more flexible for programmers. There is a RENUMber command. And lines can be changed by LISTing them and then changing them right on the screen. There is also an EDIT command which puts the program (or a selected portion of it) into ASCII form for easy manipulation. (The Model 100 may have this last feature, I don't know). The NEC uses the more standard LOCATE X,Y format while the Model 100 uses PRINT@. The PRINT@ command uses less bytes, but you can't locate a position on the screen without printing something there. The NEC lets you define user characters, whereas the Model 100 has defined them for you. The NEC also has Menu utilities built in like KILL, NAME, LOAD, SAVE & BANK switch. While I believe that these functions have to be done from BASIC on the 100. The NEC can LIST a file from the Menu, while the 100 LISTs from within the text file. The 100 also has a screen dump from within a text file. As is probably obvious from the above description, I consider the NEC to be a more flexible, more powerful machine. However, the level of support and number of after-market products for the Model 100 is considerably greater. Radio Shacks are everywhere, and a number of 3rd party suppliers for the 100 (like PCSG) have not bothered to support the NEC at all. Further, a lot of the 3rd party software that is available for the NEC was designed for te 100 and then just translated to run on the NEC. So you find software, for example, that gives you the ability to kill or rename a file easily, something the NEC already has. Also, I've run into situations where NEC wanted $40 for a printer cable only to discover that Tandy was selling a printer cable (that also works on the NEC) for $15. NEC A/C adapter for $20, Radio Shack's for $6, etc. This is fine as long as the Model 100 products work on the NEC, but many of them don't. My advice (and it's worth exactly what you paid for it) is to avoid the M10 (sorry Hillary) unless you are only going to use the machine for limited purposes in the field and then dump everything to a desktop. The M10 is really an orphan. The NEC at least has made a space for itself. They recently lowered the price among rumors they were going to dump their remaining stock, but sales proved so good that they are continuing (I've heard) to have additional machines made. More and more aftermarket products are appearing for it and I believe this will continue. The Model 100 will be around for a long time, with plenty of support. Lots of that support translates into support for the 8201A, but not all. For an interesting comparison of the Model 100 and the NEC 8201A take a look at "The TRS-80 Model 100" by Danny Goodman (Simon & Schuster). You might take a look at the .CAT files in DL7 to see what's available here for the 8201A and the M10. And there are a few text files about differences between the three machines in there as well. Fm: Sysop Tony Anderson 76703,4062 I believe the NEC was made primarily for the European market, where external modems are the rule, and moved into the US market without adding the internal modem which is the common method of use here. Most foreign countries, you have to obtain data communication permits, and some places, rent the modem from the phone company. Yes, the Model 100 and 200 have a global or specified edit mode. PRINT@N,""; will locate the cursor at a specific location on the 100 & 200. The amount of support was what decided me in favor of the Model 100, over the NEC, which I was originally considering. Fm: Scott Hibbard 70536,674 Tony, Don't mean to be a Byte Fyter imposter, but PRINT@,; will work, too (no quotes needed). ---Scott--- Fm: Mark Schneider 75026,154 Looking back on it I have to admit that the support for the Model 100 and the lack of same for the 8201A has proved to be more important than I originally thought. Certainly the support for the 100 (like cables, etc. and this SIG) have made the 8201A a more valuable machine than it ever would have been otherwise.