KYO-2.THD --- Copyright 1987 by Phil Wheeler An original compilation of Compuserve Model 100 Forum messages for use by Forum members only. The Kyotronic 85 continues to be a hot topic on the Forum -- even though there were only 1000 of them imported, according to one report. This activity has been recognized by establishing a new Subtopic and Data Library section (S 17/DL 17) for the Kyotronic 85. The messages in this file deal with a variety of issues, from technical issues and adding linefeeds to printer output to the pros-and-cons of the Kyo85 vs. the M100/102/200. Message range: 145293 to 145771 Dates: 4/11/87 to 4/17/87 ***TECHNICAL INFORMATION*** Fm: Jay McCaslin 71500,3505 To: All Is there anyone else on this sig who is using the Kyoceros (Kyotronics) 85 computer? Is there anyone who might be able to give information about ROM calls or memory addresses? By the way, this machine does a great job of running any Model 100 software that isn't machine specific to the Model 100. Such as: PRINT.QIK, SUB.100, AMORT.100, ETC. Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Jay McCaslin 71500,3505 Not much here but some. Check the files KYO85.INF & KY.THD (DL 13). Fm: Henderson 74275,460 To: Frank Thrash Found ROM addresses for Kyo, don't really know if you are interested or if this would be helpful but here they are. from a review by Luft Pfeiff. Files: 7943, CLS: 16909, Devices: 20640, TELECOM: 20721, TERM: 20877, ADRS: 22643, SCHDL: 22650, TEXT: 23286, MaxROM: 31949, SysRAM: 62960. Mind you, I am still trying to get my modem to work with it. I realize that the feelings here are primarily negative, but for what I use it for ( writing in the field and dumping to PC for printing) I love the little guy. Darbi Fm: Neil Wick 71056,613 To: FRANK W. THRASH 75666,1246 There is a little info in the March issue of Pico magazine. Addresses comparisons are given for the M100 and KC-85 for ten example ROM locations. There is also a 2-page review which you might find interesting. Fm: Brian J. Dooley 75146,3212 To: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 I want to write something that does a full "as is" core dump. Probably adapt the document dump utility (name unknown) Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Brian J. Dooley 75146,3212 You may want to try DISASM.PW1 in DL 8. I think it will run on the Kyo, and can be used to diassemble the Kyo85 ROM for fun -- and if you say to put the output to COM:88N1E you should be able to capture it on a PC. Chunks should be small -- say 1000h bytes per segment (32 pieces). If you mean a dump of RAM to recover things, there are some programs here. Try BRO RECOVR in DL 7 and see what comes up. Fm: ANTIC PUBLISHING 76703,2000 To: Henderson 74275,460 (X) I too am interested in wringing everything out of the Kyo that it has. I bought it to use as a remote keyboard for my main computer (an Atari) and am ver happy with it. I like the superb Model 100 keyboard which it has. I would much like to use the Address program which apparently is in the ROM. I tried to CALL the addresses listed but got error messages. Can you help me get into this code? Fm: Henderson 74275,460 To: ANTIC PUBLISHING 76703,2000 Charles, sure, no problem. First go to TEXT and type in a name and address You need only one to start. Then save the file as "adrs.do", this is only file name to use. Return to MENU, go to BASIC and type "0 call 22643"return "1 run"return. Then save this with a name like Addrss.ba. This puts it in the main MENU. Then just slip the Menu cursor over Addrss.ba and hit enter and you have Address. Schedule is done with "Note.Do" and Call 22650. ***A LINEFEED UTILITY*** Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Tony Anderson 76703,4062 Tony, the April PICO has an article which includes Hugo's code for LF set up - - and has the patches to install the LF patch in a Kyo 85! Alas, the patch to remove it (important at times) is not included. But I can re-create it if some helpful Kyo owner will (before installing any patch!) do: print peek(64236),peek(64237) while in BASIC and put the results in a message. Then we can re-create the full printer LF patch for a SIG program. No info on the TELCOM LF patch, but generally that one is not needed. Fm: Henderson 74275,460 To: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 Printing peek(64236) gives 163. Printing peek(64237) gives 124. Hope this helps. I am going out to find the magazine right now. Darbi BTW, what does this all mean? Fm: Tony Anderson 76703,4062 To: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 Is that location a real jump, or just a RTN in the vector table? What is it in the Model 100? Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Tony Anderson 76703,4062 Well, it seems to be the same structure as the M100: Print jump vector: M100 = 64228; Ky85 = 64236 LPT continue in ROM: M100 = 32675; Ky85 = 31907 (normal jump) with the jump redirected to the new code in the F8 area by the jump in Line 5 and patched back to its normal ROM path by line 6. This code is exactly the same as FIXLF.HF1 (DL 7), except for changes in the ROM/RAM addresses. BTW -- Hugo created this at my request, after I had discovered that Text Power 100 (first version) clashed with the LF patch I was then using. It should be noted that the current PICO uses Hugo's code (with credit given) in a program to initialize the computer ("A Basic Initiator" -- and has address changes for other computers, including the Kyo85, etc.. The author is Luft Pfeiff, who did the review of the Kyotronic 85 in the March issue. but he does not include the part of the program which allows toggling the patch, an important feature for some users. Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Tony Anderson 76703,4062 There is an "interesting" thought tossed out in the April PICO re adapting disk drives to the KY85. In response to a letter form a KY85n owner, the editor says: "As to adding disk drives, why go to all that work? Why not just adapt J. K. Heilman's Disk Manager program to the KC-85. That way you can use the Tandy PDD." Whew! Not only would you need the (commented) source of DSKMGR.100, but you would need a rather complete ROM map of the Ky85. I suspect we are a long way from getting DSKMGR to run on the '200 and the NEC 8201 -- computers we know a lot more about. Fascinating! Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Henderson 74275,460 Thanks for the info -- the result is LFEED.KYO in DL 15. How it works is a long story. The two bytes at 64236/64237 (in the Kyo) are where the print jump vector is stored. Normally it jumps back ino RAM. But we can intercept it and direct it to a short program which adds a linefeed ( stored in the function key RAM area, in this case). For more info, read LFUTL.INF & LFUTL.DES in DL 7. Fm: John Maio 76012,2252 To: ALL I have a Kyosonics 85 (which I use primarily as a packet radio terminal) and can report that the program LFEED.KYO listed in DL 15 works just fine. Also, DL Liquidators said they plan to offer a battery-powered disk dirve for the '85 in the next month or so. They are also evaluating a bubble memory "SUPEROM" for use with the KYO. No details available. ***PROS-AND-CONS OF THE KYO85*** Fm: Brian J. Dooley 75146,3212 To: Henderson 74275,460 Had to comment on that. I also have a Kyo, and love it. I am a high volume tech writer, and now do EVERYTHING on the machine. Can carry it with, and upload to office WP system. Carry it with me at all times, and transfer material via null modem to my Compaq, or, via a $25 Tandy 300 baud external modem with no problem. Have checked and adapted numerous Basic programs--only the reverse date stamp is a (very tiny) problem. Am working on the machine code problem. I just don't see why all the negative comments. The expansion "problem" is a joke...by the time real expansion is wanted, ALL of these machines will be dated...and I've only spent $200! Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Brian J. Dooley 75146,3212 Well, BJ, *real* expansion is here, for the Model 100 et al. I'm banging this out on a M100 with 256K RAM and Sardine (neat WP with spell checker in ROM). And there are all the other things (e.g., disk drives with OS, etc.). All is not to belittle the Kyo -- but many will find the more expensive machines, with expansion goodies, a better buy. But for many applications/ users, the Kyo will be super. Fm: Brian J. Dooley 75146,3212 To: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 Just read the Kyo files. On expansion, as with C-64, by the time you've added the etceteras, you've paid more than for a PC (+) class unit. For the normal purposes of such a machine, it is an excellent buy. Fm: Phil Wheeler 71266,125 To: Brian J. Dooley 75146,3212 Well, it's all in what you want. Many find an expanded M100/102/200 *more* valuable than a PC portable. I have both, and the M100 is with me more while traveling. On price: some of the expansions are getting to be reasonable -example is the Node RAMPAC for the 102 (32K plugh in pack at $49, or $139 for three). For my money, a well-supported machine (in terms of hardware and even free m/l software here) is worth the extra money -- as is the built in modem. Admittedly a very personal and application-dependent choice (and I do like to keep my expansion options open). The article in the March PICO says that only 1000 were imported. True? If so, we seem to have a good percentage of them here! BTW -- if I didn't have two M100's and a Tosh, I'd buy a Kyo, just for the challenge of seeing how far it can be extended -- an early M100 challenge which has been largely realized!